Short Words...

There is an online discussion (30 min web video) with Veronica Lewis from The Place and others at 18 Doughty Street about Arts and Elitism.
http://doughty.gdbtv.com/player.php?h=a9dd1ca3be5763c51b940ffb52b1bd94

The discussion is a taster of the 'Is ballet too elitist?' debate (28/10/2007) at this year's Battle of Ideas festival:
http://www.battleofideas.org.uk/index.php/site/session_detail/218/

To stimulate discussion Dr Shirley Dent, of the Institute of Ideas, has a provocative piece in the next Ballet.co Magazine:
The best dance is elite dance

Long words...

A time old question and this is a lead in to the up and coming debate at this years Battle of Ideas festival in which Shobana Jeyasingh, Jeffery Taylor, Ian Archer-Watters and Dr Shirley Dent (chair) discuss the motion on the 28 October at the Henry Moore Gallery, Royal College of Art. More details and context here:
Battle for Ideas debate - Is ballet too elitist?

As a lead in the website '18 Doughty Street' (www.18doughtystreet.com) has a 30 minute web video discussion called Battle Talk - Arts and Elitism:
Video Link - Battle Talk - Arts and Elitism

The background blurb on this...

Battle Talk - Arts and Elitism
Dr Shirley Dent, Communications Director for the Institute of Ideas, presents Battle Talk, a tantalising teaser of the forthcoming Battle of Ideas.

Guests are: Prof Raymond Tallis, Professor of Geriatric Medicine at the University of Manchester, Natalie Melton, Commercial Director of Arts and Business and Veronica Lewis, Director of London Contemporary Dance School and The Place.

This discussion is wide ranging but devotes good time to dance and the Dance Manifesto (pdf link), which was brought together by Dance UK

To prepare for and accompany the 'Is ballet too elitist?' discussion (the Chair) Dr Shirley Dent has written a provocative article which we are running in the November Ballet.co Magazine:
Stop this political prancing and get to the pointe – the best dance is elite dance

As Dent says"...it takes issue with the Dance Manifesto I am afraid, which although I think is laudable in many of its aims, some of it makes me want to jump up and down and pull my hair out. It is provocative but I really do think we need to provoke debate around this issue."

Long words or short - it's over to you... Is ballet (and dance) Too Elitist?

It also depends on time, place and the ambiance of the political regime. When Russia was Soviet, the restrictions on attendance I believe was vastly lifted, so I think it depends on what country you are speaking of and the degree of state subsidy to support the expense of production.

As co-director of San Francisco Ballet Michael Smuin's policy was "the cheapest seat to a company performance is the same as the price to a first run movie house." He was a populist par excellence; ironically it costs much more to purchase a ticket to his company these days.

I want to reiterate an old, tired song-and-dance of mine. When the Mayflower landed at Plymouth Rock, its occupants had left an England which was embroiled in the Stuart-Cromwell conflicts, and France was beginning to refine its culture under the Bourbon dynasty. Neither Stuarts nor Bourbons advocated ballet's predecessors for its town or country folk; as a consequence the burgeoning art form was intimately connected with expensive pageants and diversions for royalty,the court, its intrigue. Ballet,therefore, got connected with court patronage, status, expensive productions and decadent past times. This was anathema in the New England colonies;perhaps from Maryland and Virginia south, which tended to be colonized by expansive landholdings and overt forms of racially-based slavery, there may have been exceptions. New Orleans early hosted ballet artists; there was a triangle of touring which included Havana, Mexico City and New Orleans in the latter part of the eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries. Still the relative crudeness of the new nation was hardly a backdrop for the practice of a dance form ideally requiring a decade of training. John Adams once wrote something to the effect that he must practice politics so that his sons could pursue business and his grandsons the arts.

This does not mean that ballet lacks a universal appeal. Once seen, the technical mastery and the interpretive artistry is utterly captivating. It's simply to say it costs to learn to dance it, to earn one's living by it. to maintain the atmosphere fostering the best examples of it.

I think, however, that it is necessary to disaggregate some of the issues to understand them more clearly. Are we talking about elitism in terms of accessability and career development as a performer? Or from the audience's perspective (as Sim has focused on above)? Are we talking elitism in a competitive sense - striving to achieve success in ballet in terms of mastering technique or delivering challenging peformances? Are we talking about ballet being elitist or dance being elitist? Dr Dent's article is about ballet but she references the dance manifesto which clearly has a much wider application.

We are all coloured by our own experiences and I see dance as potentially a significant tool for inclusiveness and, in that respect, I think that the Dance Manifesto is an excellent initiative because (politically correct, or not) dance can do the things that the DM claims. It won't take the kid in Tower Hamlets out of poverty (although it might if they make a career out of it) but it will give them fun and - potentially - some satisfaction. So, dance in general is not elitist - in fact, anyone who has seen what dance can do for children and adults who can do very little else in special needs schools, in prisons, in care homes, in hospitals and hospices both as performers and spectators will understand very well the unique power that dance in its widest context can have over the human spirit.

Ballet, per se, is not elitist. Anyone can watch and enjoy ballet without the least idea of what the discipline or language is; anyone can begin to learn ballet, at any age, and given the highly specialised technique involved, this is significant. My daughter attends many ballet classes every week across five different schools and when I collect her from them, it sometimes overlaps with beginners classes for women of a certain age - there is nothing intrinsically elitist about what they do, but there is always something for them to strive to do better (if they wish), but it's very clear that they are all having fun!

As well as having an early involvement in and a lifelong love of ballet (which has grown to accommodate most dance forms) I've also had a lifelong involvement in the sport of fencing - in which I trained and competed at an elite level. There are many, many similarities between the two - both are based on an inherent, classical discipline which has changed little in theory over two centuries but has developed immensely in application; both are based on clearly defined positions of the arms and feet; both spring from the same period and have had similar historical developments; both are rooted in the same cultures and national identities (France, Italy, Russia), both are activities that stem from a controlled movement palette - I could go on, and on!

The real point here is that it doesn't matter if you dance or fence for a week or 50 years, there will always be the need to practice the art to maintain a standard and there will always be the capacity for improvement. Obviously both ballet and fencing require physical conditioning to be carried out at an elite level but it is possible to strive towards the perfection of technique throughout life. I recall Leo Kersley - then well in his 80s - asking a retired dancer whether he still took class every day and being horrified when the dancer said that he did not - Kersley then executed a disciplined sequence of high-technique barre exercises to prove his point!

At a performance level, I don't think ballet (or fencing) can be too elitist at the level of the elite since they are arts in which one strives to achieve an impossible perfection.

Where I think ballet has become too elite is in its role as a gateway to a dance career. Young children (unfortunately almost all girls) who want to dance will mostly follow two routes - ballet or social dancing (ie ballroom/latin). It's difficult for a young child who wants to be a contemporary dancer or to follow any other structured dance form to find somewhere to train, pre-16. I understand that classical ballet technique underpins all dance forms, but not all dancers need to have a ballet shape or a ballet dancer's hyper-mobility - the problem is that young dancers are judged on their potential for turn-out and on the range of their flexibility at 12 or 13, even if their ambition as a dancer has nothing to do with turn-out. I worry about how modern ballet standards creep all over every dance discipline during this crucial period of formation.

As a dance writer and researcher it is clear to me that many of the dancers properly regarded as legendary in previous generations would struggle to get into a company by today's standards and many of the leading dancers in the world of contemporary dance and physical theatre have not the right shape or flexibility to have ever made it in ballet BUT other vocational career routes are not recognised until post-16.

From a performance perspective, the best dance is elite dance whatever the form; but dance is also accessible and inclusive; it can help communities; it can help people with special needs; it can help improve health. These things are not mutually exclusive.

Graham

All the arts demand “elitist” performances, by which I mean the very best (and I would argue that any artist not seeking to offer such a performance should pack up their bags and leave now), though it seems we are slowly becoming encouraged to accept the mediocre as its replacement. Too often we may attend ballet and dance performances around the country to see the show carried by its Principal performers and those lower down the ranks “winging it” in soloist roles and showing a seeming lack of classical training. Such problems are brought into sharp focus by the appearances of companies such as the Bolshoi, which reveal thoroughbred “elitist” performances up and down the ranks.

How has this climate of accepting the mediocre developed? I think much of the fault lies with the BBC and its failure to meet its public service mandate by reducing the number of arts programmes and broadcasts to the point of near non-existence. For the purposes of this posting I have just looked up Clement Crisp’s review of the year 1980 published in the FT in January 1981. In it he praises the BBC for its year of dance broadcasts. Included in this list are Napoli from the Scottish Ballet, London Festival Ballet dancing La Sylphide, Graduation Ball and Njinsky, the Royal Ballet performing Swan Lake with Makarova and Dowell, plus a 25-programme season of ballet and contemporary dance films, including recorded masterclasses with Dame Alicia Markova. Compare that with the offerings on the BBC in recent years and you see a pattern. Yes, Strictly Come Dancing is great entertainment, but it is no more encouraging us to watch an elitist art than when Nureyev danced Swan Lake with Miss Piggy. The problem is that for many people this is the only exposure to an elitist art form and the effect is that it numbs the senses.

Is ballet elitist? No. It is slowly becoming mediocre and we need to open our eyes to it and demand more.

When I look out across the theater I see an audience of all kinds of people. Some men are in business suits and ties, some are in jeans. Women are wearing everything from jeans to long gowns. There are teens, seniors, kids and everything in between. Some are obviously long time attendees, some coming for the first time. Some arrive in limosines, some on motorcycles. For some this is a rare treat, others have season ticket seats for many years. Some tickets are more costly than others, some people save up to be able to afford them, other people consider the price as unimportant.

I daresay this description fits many of the people posting here. It seems to me that ballet appeals to people across the economic landscape.

Shall we make all seats the same price and just let everyone run for the best seat? Surely then we will have an elitism of those young enough and healthy enough to shove out the slower amongst us.

I think this appeal of ballet has broadened with the years, not lessened. I remember when I first started going to the ballet and opera in Philadelphia at the beautiful hisoric Academy of Music, the only way we could get a really good seat was if someone who had season tickets was unable to attend and turned their tickets back in. One could only get first rate season tickets if someone died. Boxes were impossible to get for the unwashed. People in those seats came in chauffeured limos - in gowns, furs, jewels, formal black tie, tuxedos, tiaras, etc. When we were able to get - one time only - such a seat, we were surrounded by obvious wealth and formality. My husband and I were in our young 20's and though dressed in our best, felt terribly out of place - a blot on an otherwise splendid vista of wealth and power.

Such is not the case today. At least not as I see it in the theaters which I attend. Today, I think we see a much more mixed audience.

From the point of view of the performers.......

Why is ballet selected out for a discussion of elitism? Every art form is elitist in that only a few of its participants make it. How many people studying the piano have the capability of becoming concert pianists? How many artists end up with paintings in the permanent collections of museums? How many authors end up in the permanent collection of a library? How many tenors or sopranos end up on the major opera stages?

These people who do have two qualitiies - a natural capability which, however, is worthless unless tied to a lifetime of dedication. Yes, some luck is involved. But, luck is worthless without that natural talent and the life long dedication to hard work.

Why do we go to the theater? To see talented people doing things.

Life isn't fair, some of us are just prettier than others.

EXACTLY. It seems to me the case that of all the arts ballet is somehow considered to be "elitist", in the same way that tennis might still be considered to be an "elitist" sport. WHY? Is it because it is the only art which demands physical excellence and beauty?

edited to remove a "from" and thus correct the grammar

The word elite is used as a term of abuse.

Some would say the opera house is full of tory toffs. The tabloids like to use the term toffs when writing about the ROH.

Professor Higgins, Colonel Pickering and Eliza Doolittle......

Absolutely! We spend our time defending against this - which means we are always being defensive. I'm through with that.

I've gotten to the point in my old age (after decades of being assaulted) when someone says this to me, I say "fine - don't go - there will be more seats available for me to chose from."

Now, if someone says to me that they don't understand ballet (which is also - often but not always - another way to say its too "highbrow") I say: "there's nothing to understand. If you like it fine - if not - also fine."

However, it might be amusing to ask someone who says that ballet is elitist "what would you do to make it less elitist?"

And then apply that to football.

Expensive yes and maybe only appealing to certain sorts of people but that's the art form and every art form in general.

If you want to see a ballet you can and you can pay £6 for a very good view at the back of the stalls circle. I just don't think that there's a huge market for ballet but they're not pricing people out.

When the Opera House put on the Chroma bill last year, the ticket prices were dropped a lot. This was, I assume, in the hope that people who wouldn't have gone to the ballet normally may decide to take a leap into something new.

For me it may still retain it's elitist image, not because it is but because it is perceived to be and because of the types of audiences that attend which can give it a less inviting image.

I find it interesting to notice the difference between ROH audiences and say the Coliseum and Sadlers Wells audiences who are far more diverse in demographic.

I also remember seeing a play at the National Theatre some years ago in which there was a scene that took place in the foyer of the ROH. It was not supposed to be a gala occasion but everyone wore "black tie" or long dresses and there were bewigged flunkeys standing around. I remember thinking at the time that it gave a totally misleading impression of what such an occasion would really have been like, and that it was a bit of a disgrace that the National Theatre should have staged it in this fashion.

I am going to bring this downmarket by employing a similar device related to fencing.

Fencing is seen as an elitist sport (like showjumping, shooting, sailing)- it is something that only toffs do in public schools, universities and gentlemens' clubs.

For as long as I've been involved we have tried to dispell this image and - in fact - our most successful fencers in the past two decades have been a working class boy from an Afro-Caribbean ethnic background, by way of Huddersfield, and a North London boy, who was discovered by his coach walking around a supermarket.

We were doing quite well in getting across the universal appeal of the sport and then the Bond film 'Die Another Day' came along! For those of you who have not had the dubious pleasure of seeing this film (which is perhaps worthwhile if only for the image of Halle Berry emerging from the sea in a parody of the famous Ursula Andress scene from an earlier Bond fim) the evil characters are champion fencers and several scenes are set in their "fencing club", which of course is an oak-lined gymnasium in Mayfair where everyone speaks Queen's English better than the Queen and bow ties are obligatory under the fencing jacket! At one fell swoop, anything we had done to deflate the elitist imagery of the sport was obliterated.

I'm afraid that ballet suffers the same basic problem - it will always be seen as elitist in this sense and that's that.

The good thing about the Bond film (and the good thing about the usually excellent profile for ballet in the media) is that people wanted to take up fencing as a result, even though the message was so distorted. For two years after the release of the film and the DVD it was impossible to get a beginners' place at a fencing club in London which convinced me (if I needed convincing) that there is no such thing as bad publicity.

G